tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post6101933918692806276..comments2024-03-28T04:13:36.779-04:00Comments on Mike Norman Economics: The Young Turks on the Minimum Wage. mike normanhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03296006882513340747noreply@blogger.comBlogger57125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-166872518606176952016-07-04T19:07:34.692-04:002016-07-04T19:07:34.692-04:00Tom,
The bulk of the breeders nowadays are genera...Tom,<br /><br />The bulk of the breeders nowadays are generally the middling to low IQ bunch. <br /><br />Idiocracy.Malmo's Ghosthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01072599785196733846noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-56540733652831371512016-07-04T13:10:13.679-04:002016-07-04T13:10:13.679-04:00When the interests of your loved ones butts up aga...<i>When the interests of your loved ones butts up against those you hardly know, then human nature kicks in and "family" wins. Collective consciousness goes right out the window.</i><br /><br />Family, clan, tribe, nation.<br /><br />Territorial disputes.<br /><br />War.<br /><br />Humans are brainier primates.<br /><br />That sums up history.<br /><br />At the same time, evolution has been at work and continues to be at work.<br /><br />The potential is there to advance but opportunity needs to be seized.<br /><br />Otherwise, get ready for a big culling. Tom Hickeyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08454222098667643650noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-47462073309580264272016-07-04T12:56:40.787-04:002016-07-04T12:56:40.787-04:00When the interests of your loved ones butts up aga...When the interests of your loved ones butts up against those you hardly know, then human nature kicks in and "family" wins. Collective consciousness goes right out the window.Malmo's Ghosthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01072599785196733846noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-34571332314173821282016-07-04T12:55:27.828-04:002016-07-04T12:55:27.828-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.Malmo's Ghosthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01072599785196733846noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-47088069012078986942016-07-04T12:22:13.046-04:002016-07-04T12:22:13.046-04:00.....Think good neighbors and the tall fences need...<i>.....Think good neighbors and the tall fences needed to maintain the arrangement in the "REAL WORLD".</i><br /><br />What happens is that the focus then falls on "tall fences."<br /><br />See Robert Frost, <a href="http://writing.upenn.edu/~afilreis/88/frost-mending.html" rel="nofollow">Mending Wall</a><br /><br />Then there is, Build bridges not walls.<br /><br />But then the problem becomes imagining trolls under the bridges.<br /><br />As I have said, real love depends on apprehension (not just understanding) of the unity of being. <br /><br />Those who busy themselves with building walls, imagining trolls under bridges, or wasting their freedom on trivial pursuits won't develop this apprehension, even though it is their birthright as human beings. This is the metaphorical meaning of selling one's birthright for a bowl of porridge.<br /><br />Then humanity descends into animality and fights over territorial control. That's what walls are about.Tom Hickeyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08454222098667643650noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-67091894648700153802016-07-04T12:08:44.533-04:002016-07-04T12:08:44.533-04:00It gets far more complicated when legislating love...<i>It gets far more complicated when legislating love (forced love of EVERYBODY and all the social engineering that goes with it) rears its ugly head</i><br /><br />Of course, it is impossible to legislate love or any of the other virtues.<br /><br />It is possible to legislate freedom, distinguishing between freedom and license. Freedom is not merely freedom from constraint, or freedom to chose, but freedom for self-actualization individually and self-determination socially. This implies that freedom entails responsibility in its exercise. <br /><br />While it is possible to legislate freedom, living a good life in a good society requires training in its exercise. <br /><br />American philosopher and educator John Dewey wrote extensively on this relative to liberalism and democracy.<br /><br />Education based on reading, writing and 'rithmetic is insufficient and education based on teaching to the test is crazy. <br /><br />Education needs to be redesigned as learning for life.Tom Hickeyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08454222098667643650noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-9759931804299064812016-07-04T11:15:58.903-04:002016-07-04T11:15:58.903-04:00Parents generally do this for their children. If c...<i>Parents generally do this for their children. If childless, then one might sacrifice for parents or close friends. It gets far more complicated when legislating love (forced love of EVERYBODY and all the social engineering that goes with it) rears its ugly head. </i><br /><br />In the world as it presently exists, uncondtional universal love is only possible in a limited way, But that way is not fixed. As Stephen Pinker argues in The Better Angels of our Nature, we have come a long way. <br /><br />This is what I means when I say that the prerequisite for positive social change is raising the level of collective consciousness. <br /><br />The important message of perennial wisdom is that increasing love in the direction of unconditional universal love is possible for any individual and therefore for societies to the degree that individuals influence each other reciprocally. <br /><br />This is what it means to ask the fundamental question, What does it mean to live a good life as an individual in a good society.<br /><br />An answer can be given intellectually but intellectual understanding is not sufficient to bring it about.<br /><br />But intellectual understanding can address creating the conditions for this both by removing obstacles and upgrading.<br /><br />If humanity doesn't shoot for this, then the result, as history amply demonstrates, is conflict. In an age of WMD, that is not an option for intelligent people to accept.Tom Hickeyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08454222098667643650noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-42410788112229201032016-07-04T10:51:26.465-04:002016-07-04T10:51:26.465-04:00.....Think good neighbors and the tall fences need........Think good neighbors and the tall fences needed to maintain the arrangement in the "REAL WORLD".Malmo's Ghosthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01072599785196733846noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-89641241931819684252016-07-04T10:49:39.506-04:002016-07-04T10:49:39.506-04:00"Real love is putting others' happiness b..."<i>Real love is putting others' happiness before one's own"</i><br /><br />Sure, but on a limited basis. <br /><br />Parents generally do this for their children. If childless, then one might sacrifice for parents or close friends. It gets far more complicated when legislating love (forced love of EVERYBODY and all the social engineering that goes with it) rears its ugly head. <br /><br />Perennial wisdom also teaches charity begins at home. Tribal charity if you will. That's pretty much where mine and most others selfless love ends. Especially in a world of 7 billion. But limited charity also implies a desired harmonic world too, otherwise the limited ones you sacrifice for could not be happy. But that's the rub. And that's why the utopia Tom speaks of will never come to pass in the "global" sense.Malmo's Ghosthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01072599785196733846noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-80645281969766437032016-07-04T09:50:39.147-04:002016-07-04T09:50:39.147-04:00rather than focusing on the results.. Franko
Resu...<i>rather than focusing on the results..</i> Franko<br /><br />Results such as the Great Depression and WWII? Since both are a result of the unprincipled, unjust banking model you support?Andrew Andersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14296407661618321637noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-44925515469166229892016-07-04T09:12:39.441-04:002016-07-04T09:12:39.441-04:00John
I think I took that from a translation on-l...John<br /> <br />I think I took that from a translation on-line somewhere here is the one I use:<br /><br />"a man who lies with a male as bedding with a woman they do an abhorrance. The two of them shall be put to death... yada yada..."<br /><br />or here is a literal interlinear one here just go to Lev 20:13<br /><br />http://scripture4all.org/OnlineInterlinear/OTpdf/lev20.pdf<br /><br />Pretty fair to say it was talking about what we would term today male homosexual activity (and btw females not even mentioned...) ... and imo our Greek ancestors would term those among them of the 'sodomite' and or 'catamite' temple sects (1 Cor 6:9) .. like we have today Catholics, Lutherans, Baptists, Pentacostals, etc... <br /><br />bottom line here is 'Andrew' is trying to pick and choose from those laws and is obsessed with the qualities/details of the method rather than focusing on the results... this is completely missing the mark...<br /><br /><br /><br />Matt Frankohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11082502216984169113noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-67071051289547212782016-07-04T08:11:04.093-04:002016-07-04T08:11:04.093-04:00John stand by let me check my translation....John stand by let me check my translation....Matt Frankohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11978352335097260145noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-33270078053223658072016-07-03T23:39:05.414-04:002016-07-03T23:39:05.414-04:00Neither are going to happen anytime soon so there ...<i>Neither are going to happen anytime soon so there is no use in arguing over it while the world speeds toward oblivion.</i> Tom Hickey<br /><br />One message of the Old Testament is that it is never too late to repent if we are willing. Even when Nebuchadnezzar was outside the walls of Jerusalem the Jews could have repented and spared themselves a lot of misery. Indeed, they did repent for a while by freeing their illegally held Hebrew (presumably debt) slaves and God called off the Babylonians. (Alas, the repentance was only temporary since they re-enslaved those they had freed when they thought the Babylonians were gone for good. God was not amused to say the least (See Jeremiah 34:12-22))<br /><br />My focus on justice is precisely because that is what can move God to spare us. We can start with a Steve-Keen-like debt jubilee to free our own debt slaves. And we should eliminate a major cause of that slavery: government subsidies for usury.Andrew Andersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14296407661618321637noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-11856950914864636232016-07-03T23:33:23.929-04:002016-07-03T23:33:23.929-04:00Matt: "If a man has sexual relations with a m...Matt: "If a man has sexual relations with a man as one does with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They are to be put to death" Lev 20:13<br /><br />Well, perhaps this is pedantry on my part, but it is a literal and physical impossibility for a man to have have sexual relations with a man *AS ONE DOES WITH A WOMAN* because men don't have vaginas. Or am I missing something here? It really wasn't the kind of thing that came up during my youthful happy clappy Anglican days. <br /><br />Other than a bad translation, which the Bible is rife with, there is another possibility. A man may sodomise a woman but to do so to another man (that is the anal sex "as one does with a woman") is "detestable" and "are to be put to death". There is therefore a double standard in the law of sodomy.<br /><br />I'll have to pop visit my local churches and ask for clarification.Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18181631191840432399noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-6710716717944913842016-07-03T20:30:25.099-04:002016-07-03T20:30:25.099-04:00The secret to creating ideal society is simple.
...The secret to creating ideal society is simple. <br /><br />The way to abiding individual happiness lies in making others happy. <br /><br />The more people that do this, the more the process is self-augmenting. <br /><br />Why this is not easy: It requires love.<br /><br />Real love is putting others' happiness before one's own.<br /><br />This is the teaching of perennial wisdom.Tom Hickeyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08454222098667643650noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-77059159307016056562016-07-03T20:25:46.471-04:002016-07-03T20:25:46.471-04:00Bucky Fuller gave the example of Bell Labs. It was...Bucky Fuller gave the example of Bell Labs. It was designed as an R&D center outfitted with state of the art resources and staffed with the best and brightest who were turned loose to "play." The creativity was amazing and the innovation paid for the investment thousands of times over.<br /><br />Fuller suggested that doing this even on a limited scale socially would produce similarly enormous innovation that would "pay for itself" thousands of times over in real terms owing to the innovation that would be unleashed.<br /><br />The mistake of capitalism is that money-incentivized entrepreneurship is needed to create the incentive for innovation.<br /><br />The reality is that humans are naturally creative and love to play. Create "sandboxes" for teams to play in and watch the outcome, especially when this is the basis of education beginning in preschool.<br /><br />According to Sir Ken Robinson, every child is a genius at age three but the percentage of geniuses begins to decrease with every successive year of education. He lays it to the educational paradigm and advocates changing the paradigm.<br /><br />Most of the issues that humanity faces now are self-imposed. We have the knowledge and resources to solve virtually all the so-called problems that humanity faces and we also know how to go about solving those issues that remain to be resolved.<br /><br />The trouble is that we just can't get our shit together to do it. As Roger says, it's a coordination issue. We are not taking advantage of return on coordination, which is exponential.Tom Hickeyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08454222098667643650noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-49011597415725702762016-07-03T20:10:20.726-04:002016-07-03T20:10:20.726-04:00A lot of people agree with you, Matt.
Historica...A lot of people agree with you, Matt. <br /><br />Historically countries that prepared for war have gone to war.<br /><br />Moreover, it's a foregone conclusion that the next one will involve WMD, either nuclear (Russia, China), or chemical/biological (radicals). In fact, the radicals are already using chemical weapons.<br /><br />To me all this looks like insanity.Tom Hickeyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08454222098667643650noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-40410217419873287562016-07-03T20:04:01.009-04:002016-07-03T20:04:01.009-04:00Tom if everyone majors in bongo playing in colleg...Tom if everyone majors in bongo playing in college or if you drive out all the non bongo players we're going to have a hard time with things like clean water, sanitation, transportation, medicine, agriculture you name it look at Venezuela....Matt Frankohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11978352335097260145noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-40704390031198141252016-07-03T19:56:35.221-04:002016-07-03T19:56:35.221-04:00Tom that "complex" is what is making all...Tom that "complex" is what is making all of our material systems function right now.... And function very well imo....<br /><br />You get rid of that "complex" and we are Venezuela or back to teepees... Noooooo thanks...<br /><br />You non material people should just let us material people handle it and take a chill pill...<br /><br />. But of course, we want to get paid well you just have to get over it... Matt Frankohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11978352335097260145noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-36853467247504362872016-07-03T19:22:02.101-04:002016-07-03T19:22:02.101-04:00Andrew Anderson: With just income and wealth distr...Andrew Anderson: <i>With just income and wealth distribution, a lot of those "free" goods and services would not be necessary in the first place since people could afford to buy what they needed to a large extent.<br /><br />So the provision of those "free" services to a large extent is not justice but rather an attempted substitute for it.</i><br /><br />Tom, of course is right on all counts above.<br /><br />For this gets things even more backwards than the average UBI proponent, who in turn make the neoclassical/mainstream economists look good (Wray). And (mainstream) economists (econometricians/forecasters) according to old saw that Galbraith liked but didn't originate, make astrologers look good.<br /><br />Again, UBI /= justice, UBI = slavery (but because it simply can't work, it is just the tragedy repeated as a farce). On the other hand, a JG is logically, apodictically necessary to a "just income & wealth distribution".<br /><br />The free (or affordable) services are "justice". The crazy idea to charge for them & pay people a fake UBI income to pay for them (why on earth bother? - this is just playacting, at best) is not even an "attempted substitute for", but the antithesis of justice. This is the pernicious privatization = briberization going on right now - replace state run prisons or schools or medical services with inferior, more expensive, private ones. Replace public water systems with ones that charge an arm and a leg. Etc everywhere ad infinitum. For surely these wonderful private providers (of "justice" - ha!) wouldn't raise prices to get every bit of the lesser people's UBI/BIG "income" - oh no no no. BIG = Billionaire's Income Guarantee. <br /><br />I know you mean well, but this is hyper-neoliberalism for those born ass-backwards yesterday.Calgacushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06031818010224747000noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-64067511577728454272016-07-03T17:32:26.525-04:002016-07-03T17:32:26.525-04:00" BACON bits"
Don't tell me... its ..." BACON bits"<br /><br />Don't tell me... its turkey bacon????Matt Frankohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11082502216984169113noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-85596444770184505112016-07-03T17:12:50.131-04:002016-07-03T17:12:50.131-04:00The solution is justice via a UBI and/or asset red...<i>The solution is justice via a UBI and/or asset redistribution. That makes the cost of labour irrelevant since people won't need jobs to live.</i><br /><br />Before that can happen, the ideologues must be confronted with the specter of increasing unemployment. And instead of blaming the individual, the blame will fall on structural changes in the economy i.e. automation.Peter Panhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09473311771939167712noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-19608412597901403002016-07-03T15:40:16.685-04:002016-07-03T15:40:16.685-04:00Neither are going to happen anytime soon so there ...Neither are going to happen anytime soon so there is no use in arguing over it while the world speeds toward oblivion.<br /><br />Bucky Fuller wrote a book entitle, Utopia or Oblivion.<br /><br />Those are the stark choices. Either we get ahold of this military-industrial-financial-intelligence-governmental complex or it will exterminate us all.<br /><br />What's happened since the end of WWII and especially since the collapse of the USSR is that the US and its allies are building up the world's most powerful military machine ever assembled to guarantee world hegemony for the US and its vassals and minions.<br /><br />One might expect that this would provoke a reaction and of course it has. Proliferation is increasing and accelerating as Russia and China arm up for example, driving yet more military expansion in the West.<br /><br />This has a very predictable outcome and the nuclear clock has never been closer to midnight.<br /><br />The alternative according to Fuller:<br /><br /><i>"The present top-priority world problem to be solved may be summarized as how to triple, swiftly, safely, and satisfyingly, the overall performances per kilos, kilowatts, and man-hours of the world's comprehensively invested resources of elements, energy, time, and intelligence. To do so will render those resources - which at the present uncoordinated, happenstance, design level can support only 44 per cent of humanity - capable of supporting 100 per cent of humanity's increasing population at higher standards of living than any human minority or single individual has ever known or dreamed of and will thus eliminate the cause of war and its weapons' frustrating diversion of productivity from the support of all mankind." (p.334)</i>Tom Hickeyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08454222098667643650noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-82286069279041798622016-07-03T14:41:58.852-04:002016-07-03T14:41:58.852-04:00Free schooling from preschool to PhD
Free day car...<i>Free schooling from preschool to PhD<br /><br />Free day care.<br /><br />Free health care on demand.<br /><br />Free elder care.<br /><br />...<br /><br />Free basic food supply.<br /><br />Free public housing.You get the idea. These are just some of the necessities.</i> Tom Hickey<br /><br />With just income and wealth distribution, a lot of those "free" goods and services would not be necessary in the first place since people could afford to buy what they needed to a large extent.<br /><br />So the provision of those "free" services to a large extent is not justice but rather an attempted substitute for it.Andrew Andersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14296407661618321637noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-80611747422968937312016-07-03T13:53:21.458-04:002016-07-03T13:53:21.458-04:00In some (many) countries public displays of affect...In some (many) countries public displays of affection are either discouraged culturally or made illegal.<br /><br />It's always a question of drawing lines. <br /><br />Who gets to the draw the lines? On what basis?Tom Hickeyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08454222098667643650noreply@blogger.com