tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post7389715541290686644..comments2024-03-28T07:50:06.102-04:00Comments on Mike Norman Economics: J. D. Alt — The (Semantic) Problem with MMT: An Exercise in Framingmike normanhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03296006882513340747noreply@blogger.comBlogger16125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-20050590036383392482012-05-23T14:44:02.066-04:002012-05-23T14:44:02.066-04:00ken (@ 5/22/12, 4:26 pm),
you took the words rig...ken (@ 5/22/12, 4:26 pm), <br /><br />you took the words right out of my mouth--that's exactly what i was driving at (@ 5/22/12, 2:18 pm).<br /><br />anyhow, the problem with MMT is, not that it's untrue, but that most people are quite uncomfortable with the truthfulness of it.<br /><br />what's really behind the taxpayer-pays-for-government-spending "meme" is a deep-seated fear most people have that MMT brings to light (by MMT, i just mean an accurate explanation of the monetary system).<br /><br />that being, that we are all just economic pawns of the government in its quest to "provision" itself. and most of us are totally dependent on its whims for our survival. and the game of survival that we play day-in, day-out is based on some crazy idea that somebody came up with eons ago.<br /><br />and none of our "governors" seems to be interested in considering alternatives and we, the pawns, don't seem to have any say-so in how our lives are "governed."Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-27256145507370611272012-05-22T19:32:17.075-04:002012-05-22T19:32:17.075-04:00This blog was mentioned in the article. Nice work ...This blog was mentioned in the article. Nice work everyone!mike normanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03296006882513340747noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-30679989069861852682012-05-22T19:03:34.741-04:002012-05-22T19:03:34.741-04:00"Is there an appropriate metaphor for this th..."Is there an appropriate metaphor for this that can be substituted for the wrong thinking that solves the framing problem by resolving the moral issue?"<br /><br />Metaphor? No.<br /><br />"I propose the replacement of our current system of individual and corporate income, sales, excise, capital gains, import and export duties, gift and estate taxes with a single comprehensive “revenue neutral” Automated Payment Transaction (APT) tax. The APT tax consists of a flat rate tax levied on all voluntary transactions. The total volume of transactions represents the broadest conceivable tax base and therefore requires the lowest conceivable marginal tax rate."<br />http://www.scribd.com/doc/25299549/Feige-APT-Presentation-to-Tax-Reform-Panel-2005beowulfhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14987548132065830204noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-71586180363623190472012-05-22T18:11:59.556-04:002012-05-22T18:11:59.556-04:00Comes back to "show and teil." People ar...Comes back to "show and teil." People are used to that. It begins in kindergarten and continues through advertising.<br /><br />Think metaphors, metaphors, metaphors.Tom Hickeyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08454222098667643650noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-8103681258759436902012-05-22T17:59:14.377-04:002012-05-22T17:59:14.377-04:00Here is a comment when asked by this article by CR...Here is a comment when asked by this article by CR in website, PR:<br /><br /><i>"I’ll have to get back to you later, but my discomfort with many MMT concepts is increasing. MMT is like the movie Inception. The deeper the levels you get into the crazier the dream appears…..I got to the money monopolist level and recognized a catatrophic error. Now I’m awake…."</i><br /><br />I guess he's monetarist friends with his novel concepts (super-neutrality, sounds like super-symmetric particles yet to be found) are making more sense to him... We are still waiting for all this revolutionary (semantic) concepts coming from MMR and his challenging of the status quo (because voting for Romney must be that challenging socialist and JG dangers in USA).<br /><br />Good grief.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-8791523914180587382012-05-22T16:57:51.160-04:002012-05-22T16:57:51.160-04:00Actually, that isn't all.
Here's some hel...Actually, that isn't all.<br /><br />Here's some helpful information on the best way to sell stuff…<br /><br />"Speaking of Apple and retina displays, Dan Ackerman:<br /><br /> For example, today I could easily tell someone shopping for a laptop that a good sweet spot to look for in a premium 13-inch laptop is a screen resolution of 1600 × 900 pixels. In the future, would I have to suggest 1600 × 900 if a laptop is from one list of PC makers with one type of DPI technology, and a second set of recommended resolutions for brands that use different DPI settings? Good luck fitting all that on the shelf tag at a brick-and-mortar retailer.<br /><br />I can’t tell if this is a joke, parodying the antiquated specs-driven process of buying a Wintel PC, or if Ackerman really has zero clue about how Apple works, and why people buy Apple products.<br /><br />Here’s how Apple will sell retina display MacBooks: <em>by telling us and showing us that they’re jaw-droppingly beautiful.</em> That’s it.<br /><br />I can come out of left field with the best of 'em.paul melihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04604543110795683837noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-40049221083883920232012-05-22T16:49:47.639-04:002012-05-22T16:49:47.639-04:00Tax rents not income.
That is all.Tax rents not income.<br /><br />That is all.paul melihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04604543110795683837noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-18132395859421963862012-05-22T16:26:14.935-04:002012-05-22T16:26:14.935-04:00Trouble is getting people to (mostly) play by the ...Trouble is getting people to (mostly) play by the rules and pay their taxes if you drop the illusion that they are "funding gov't". Regulate someone else's aggregate demand, thank you very much! I'll regulate my own!<br /><br />So is this a necessary illusion?Kennoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-89107804196181494032012-05-22T15:28:18.131-04:002012-05-22T15:28:18.131-04:00it's a whole lot easier believing the "fi...<i>it's a whole lot easier believing the "fiction" than facing the truth.</i> [Anonymous]<br /><br />Note the similarity between economic and religious conventional wisdom...Detroit Danhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03718490473585220856noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-29033162744524933682012-05-22T14:18:28.922-04:002012-05-22T14:18:28.922-04:00this article quite beautifully illustrates the old...this article quite beautifully illustrates the old saying, "truth is stranger than fiction!"<br /><br />as in the story the author gave of his wife, most people just cannot believe the true function of taxes, partially because, to most, it just seems like out-and-out highway robbery and most people can't come to accept that.<br /><br />so, as i see it, this is one of the main sticking-points for proponents of MMT. it's a whole lot easier believing the "fiction" than facing the truth.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-48460331268521136002012-05-22T14:13:24.342-04:002012-05-22T14:13:24.342-04:00"BTW I would argue that "All money is ..."BTW I would argue that "All money is printed"<br /><br />I use that one regularly.<br /><br />I never get a reaction so I'm not sure how it's parsed but at least they don't get violent.paul melihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04604543110795683837noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-83569067873961971132012-05-22T13:14:04.696-04:002012-05-22T13:14:04.696-04:00It is an interesting post. I also question "f...It is an interesting post. I also question "fiscal space". Semantically it is true, however in order for newcomers to learn higher concepts they would need to perform a 'semantic transition' into taxes regulate, etc. At the same time such an approach may have less resistance. <br /><br />Hopefully it invokes some broader discussion about the dissemination of MMT.<br /><br />BTW I would argue that "All money is printed". Where the word 'printed' really means some creation process. Argue that point first and move on.....Shaun Hingstonhttps://lowerleftlimit.wordpress.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-71759659958729657562012-05-22T13:12:20.835-04:002012-05-22T13:12:20.835-04:00Ouch, tough break on the date Mike. Although I wou...Ouch, tough break on the date Mike. Although I would say religion or politics are much safer plays than MMT. There's nothing new with either of those subjects. But try dropping the "taxes and bonds don't fund anything" bomb, and people get downright angry. I think we've all experienced that. Which is why the JG is uneventful (not something I would lead with), once you can get beyond the "funding" issue. Easier said than done.Trixiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17763994914034770622noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-8232085036481121372012-05-22T13:02:14.784-04:002012-05-22T13:02:14.784-04:00"I prefer the car analogy: Government spendin..."I prefer the car analogy: Government spending is the accelerator, taxes are the brakes."<br /><br />Automatic (brakes) stabilizers are the prescription when the driver is deemed incompetent.paul melihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04604543110795683837noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-91043396407784967872012-05-22T12:47:52.884-04:002012-05-22T12:47:52.884-04:00Agree with the importance of framing, question the...Agree with the importance of framing, question the phrase "fiscal space."<br /><br />I prefer the car analogy: Government spending is the accelerator, taxes are the brakes.Dan Lynchhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11189866002273597534noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2761684730989137546.post-49204998876763846412012-05-22T12:35:38.547-04:002012-05-22T12:35:38.547-04:00Reminded me of Mike's story along this line:
...Reminded me of Mike's story along this line:<br /><br />http://mikenormaneconomics.blogspot.com/2011/01/caution-mmt-can-be-hazardous-to-your.html<br /><br />Resp,Matt Frankohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11978352335097260145noreply@blogger.com