An MMT site bringing you dogma-free economics without the pleadings of self interest
Morons outnumber wise by others of magnitude. Morons are who decide the path humanity follows.Morons will probably choose AGAIN violence and war to "solve" all our current problems, while some 'smart' sociopaths at the top 0.1% will profit from it.I see the probabilities of civil wars and even a World War increasing in the next 3 decades parabolically. Civil war and/or bloody revolution may be, for example, a given thing already in Greece, it's just a matter of when, not if.
Lev,How about how Walker talks about 'the Titanic', 'hidden icebergs', etc... all these metaphors.Similar to Simpson in Mikes Bloomberg video talking about 'babies' and Bowles talking about 'cancer'.This is revealing.This reveals that they really dont know what they are talking about or they would be able to use the correct professional terminology and be able to describe the issues without resorting to simpleton metaphors.They are literally babbling idiots if you think about it.What disgraced human beings. Sad for them really.Resp,
the screen should say "keeping america great, for people who already got it made" honesty is the best policy!
Good point Dave,If you think about it whenever America has seen the best economic outcomes, the macro ex post accounting results are JUST THE OPPOSITE of what Walker is so concerned about... I would have to think that the ability to discern this contradiction in facts would be one of the key indicators of true intelligence.Looks like too bad Walker has no true intelligence or he would be able to see this contradiction.Resp,
You forgot the Wise Guys.The Wise Guys are the people running things. They know how the game works. They know most people are suckers (morons), and think that the 'wise' (those who want to improve things) are the biggest suckers of all.Above the morons you have the Wise Guys. But the Wise Guys pretend to be oridinary morons like everyone else, so they don't attract the heat. It's 'their thing'.
"Wise Guys" are the "sociopaths in the 0.1%" in my post.And yes, these see the wise people (us, I hope) in Matt post as the biggest suckers. Why would anyone who knows how it does work not profit from it all while the sky falls? Why would anyone help 'moron's who get what they are asking for/deserve?this is the mentality of a sociopath, that's why sociopaths see the rest of us as suckers, no matter if we "just" want to improve things.A sociopath (or psychopaths too) is a person who knows the rules, but never learned to respect them during their development and childhood. They have no morality per se, they are 'dysfunctional' people in a sane society. But in the insanity asylum we live in they are Kings.In older human social structures that people could be in check (more or less), because proximal relations and emotional (unconscious) feedback we can get from them and because there were no resources to be wasted, it was simply no option to have parasites sucking the life of everybody in a social group without contributing. So that people was keep in check, and probably also they did not have the chance be grown that way (except the pure neurological failures) due to how human relations were developed and learned during development. But with civiliation this got out of hand a part of the population is grown that way (+ the neurological failures).This, along the problem of 'acknowledging you are wrong' (egos & stuff) are our biggest problem to overcome if humanity wants to get somewhere instead of just disappear like other species in a few millennia.
Matt: Sadly the lack of knowledge and maybe even malicious intent goes pretty far up the chain. I just had the non-pleasure of listening to our former finance minister Paul Martin speak at INET. I'm not sure why he was invited - I wouldn't say be brings much new economic thinking to the table. At about 47:50 he comments that he needed to reduce deficit so the "market" wouldn't raise rates. He is the perfect example of why businessmen should not run economies.Minor props to Becky this time for at least calling out the regressiveness of FICA taxes.BTW Mike, you did a nice job in this interview too. I'm really liking the idea of moving the frame away from money (whatever that is) to REAL. I'm Canadian, but spent the last 5 years in the US. There is no doubt in my mind that we are both rich countries by any REAL measure. With our small population and resource wealth, Canada should be particularly embarrassed at our unemployment rate and the number of low wage jobs we promote.I'm sure many readers here have listened to some of those INET talks. To me, they really enforced my impression that this is all about politics. There are many better REAL solutions (I like MMT) but they are blocked at every turn.Both our countries sought independence from Britain, we have a lot in common besides geography. I'm no expert, but isn't there something in the founding documents about a more perfect union. Yet, ironically, more than ever, we've become a ME ME ME ME ME society.It seems to me that taxes without representation or without seeing any public good for them is in many ways how democracies are born (and how they die). You seem to know a lot about the Romans Matt, I suppose it is not too much of a stretch to say that near the end of that empire there were lots of people paying a tax of some form without getting much voice or public good in return.Sorry for the long rant today. I don't comment as often as I'd like because I don't usually have much subject matter to add, but I wanted to say a big thanks to Mike for hosting these discussions. Thanks to Tom for his many informative links and his calm and patient approach to the conflicts that arise. Matt - keeping shooting straight from the hip - much appreciated. Too many other posters and commenters to call out by name. Thanks all for the great discussions.
Watch what you say or you might get whacked.
The problem is that ~95% of "progressive" Obama voters absolutely believe that the deficit is a serious issue.The favorite talking point among my Democratic friends is how Obama inherited deficits and how he actually has the more responsible plan to reduce the deficit.Which implies that the deficit *is* a serious issue and that Democrats are more "serious" about solving this problem.A handful of people read this blog. Meanwhile, Tyler Cowen gets op-ed space in the NYT(!!!) to spout off about unsustainable deficits.It's not like otherwise intelligent doctors and lawyers followed the Krugman/MMT spat. They just "know" that government spending is exactly like household spending and they don't give it anymore thought.
David Walker is not a moron, he's a lying SOB. He knows exactly what he is doing by trotting out all the right-wing talking points. He believes that if he keeps pounding on these points he'll get reductions in social spending. That is the real agenda of the Peterson Foundation: to eliminate the social safety net.
Precisely: it's an ideological agenda. They want to reshape society in the way that they think is best, according to their ideology, and they're using the current confusion over deficits as a perfect cover to achieve that which they've wanted for decades but haven't been able to convince enough people to support.Some of them are probably dumb enough to really believe the rhetoric though - Walker might possibly be included in that group.
JohnT,I see what you are saying, I dont deny it could be true.I think Warren M quipped the other day something like: "Either morons or subversive".So it has to be one or the other.I am trying to promote an insight that I have that it is the former ie they are morons. I leave it to others to make the case for the latter, seems like that view is well represented out there.MikeB good stuff! Please feel free to comment at any time that helps advance the process wrt the blogs imo. Reader participation type thing.Resp,
I see what you all are saying but why would he want to willfully put himself in the position of a moron to accomplish these dark ends?Going around saying basically that "the govt is out of money" is a pretty stupid thing to say, would you all not agree?Puffing yourself up as the former "Comptroller of the Currency" (ie Bean-counter-in-chief) and then being shown to posses not even a laymans understanding of state currency systems is quite disgraceful and embarrassing.I dont see people easily signing up for that duty.Resp,
Moronic people controlled by subversives....
Matt,I see your point but isn't David Walker just repeating what the majority believe? If you ask any average citizen they will say ''Yes, the govt. is running out of money, we are going bankrupt.'' Of course, it's nonsense but it is a widely held belief. Mike has to keep getting the truth out there. Walker is deliberately spreading misinformation.
Warren on David Walker:when david walker was asked about [the statement that 50% pay no income tax in relation to not counting FICA] he said in a silly logical disconnect that he didn’t count fica as a tax because it’s not enough to pay for future benefits.by that measure we shouldn’t count any taxes if they total less than spending.lhttp://moslereconomics.com/2012/04/12/the-presidents-fairness-fiction/comment-page-1
JohnT,I could see the average citizen sort of not paying much attention to the issue in reality and more or less parroting the cliches, etc...But Walker basically is devoting his professional life to this.I agree that he is deliberately spreading misinformation but I do not believe he knows that he is doing it. He is a MORON.resp
If they rephrased the argument as "high deficits will lead to higher inflation or higher taxes" then at least it would be possible to have a proper debate. Just saying, "we're running out of money" simply demonstrates that you either haven't thought about the issue much or else you're pushing an agenda.
And then there's this, which proves he's a subversive liar.
@widmerpool:A handful of people read this blog. Meanwhile, Tyler Cowen gets op-ed space in the NYT(!!!) to spout off about unsustainable deficits.Sad, but true.
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