After completing a detailed analysis, Germany's foreign intelligence service, the Bundesnachrichtendienst (BND), has concluded that pro-Russian rebels were responsible for the crash of Malaysian Airlines Flight MH17 on July 19 in eastern Ukraine while on route from Amsterdam to Kuala Lumpur.
In an Oct. 8 presentation given to members of the parliamentary control committee, the Bundestag body responsible for monitoring the work of German intelligence, BND President Gerhard Schindler provided ample evidence to back up his case, including satellite images and diverse photo evidence. The BND has intelligence indicating that pro-Russian separatists captured a BUK air defense missile system at a Ukrainian military base and fired a missile on July 17 that exploded in direct proximity to the Malaysian aircraft, which had been carrying 298 people.…Der Spiegel Online International English
Deadly Ukraine Crash: German Intelligence Claims Pro-Russian Separatists Downed MH17
11 comments:
Yet the article presents no data. We're just supposed to trust them?
Note that Gerhard Shindler is the same clown who claimed Assad was responsible for the chemical weapons attack in Syria last year -- which has since been debunked.
Sounds like this Shindler fellow is America's bitch.
http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/german-intelligence-contributes-to-fact-finding-on-syria-gas-attack-a-920123.html
Russian Lawmaker Says German MH17 Crash Intel Points to Kiev
We've all seen the shaky cell phone video of the plane being shot down and falling out of the sky in a fiery ball toward the ground... what more evidence of the plane being shot down do we need?
The people are dead. Once it was realized that it was a civilian plane, the parties involved retracted their boasts of shooting down a military plane and apologized, what else can they do? It's a war, they obviously screwed up and never intended to take down a civilian plane.
Ryan Harris said "Once it was realized that it was a civilian plane, the parties involved retracted their boasts of shooting down a military plane and apologized"
Citation on the apology please? This would be an admission of guilt. I haven't seen this.
On the available evidence, I'm still with the Ukrainian military as guilty, not the rebels.
I was trading at the time it happened and I looked at Igor Strelkov's social media account and translated it in Chrome, and it said they shot down another Russian transport plane. Then about 30 minutes later, it was removed. Saw that post with my own two eyes.
This is a summary of what happened in the moments after the crash. Initially there was elation at the take down then they became alarmed when they saw the wreckage and then the rest is history. Here is more stuff later... that is suspect and circumstantial after the event when people were trying to find evidence everywhere.
I don't know what happened apart from all that. this pretty much sums up what we know forsure. That's it for me. I don't want to offend Tom and Dan who prefer to believe in the Russian media accounts. I really don't know and am not an expert and don't want to argue about it.
I am agnostic on this.
My guess is that it was likely a mistake rather than intentional, however. The West was quick to get ahead of the media curve on the spin, blaming it on Putin without providing evidence.
I had thought that it was possible that MH17 could have been hit by a Ukrainian military aircraft reportedly in the area, but that theory fizzled on the evidence of the height of MH17 and the fighter's ceiling. So it seems that MH17 was hit with a surface to air missile, but the circumstances remain murky to unknown.
It's still not clear why MH17 was flying over a war zone, and the Ukrainians have not been forthcoming about the communication between the controllers and the crew.
While the loss of life is regrettable, it seems to me that the incident has been blown way out of proportion based on politics rather than facts.
The fighter plane theory is still viable. An SU-25 can climb to 33,000 feet if pilot has oxygen mask.
"The SU-25 is capable of briefly reaching heights in excess of 10 thousand metres."
The SU-25 "sharply gained altitude and suddenly appeared out of the clouds in front of the civilian aircraft and opened fire on the cockpit, firing from a 30 mm caliber cannon ...."
"As a result of multiple hits from shells there was damage to the cockpit, which suddenly depressurized, resulting in instant death for the crew due to mechanical influences and decompression. The attack was sudden and lasted a fraction of a second; in such circumstances the crew could not sound any alarm as the flight had been proceeding in regular mode and no attack was expected."
http://vineyardsaker.blogspot.com/2014/09/malaysian-flight-mh17-crash-analysis-by.html
Bottom line is that US intelligence knows what happened and who did it. If they had proof that a rebel BUK did the deed, they would have showed us the proof.
I would wonder why they would choose to use an SU-25 instead of the more capable SU-27, which the Ukie AF had available at the time.
Wikipedia/SU-27:
During the post-euromaidan Ukrainian crisis of 2014, a Ukrainian Air Force Su-27 was scrambled to intercept Russian fighter jets that violated Ukraine's airspace twice over the Black Sea on 3 March to prevent any possible "provocative actions".
Ryan,
Thanks for clarifying. I've seen all the same stuff long ago - not convinced. Surely one can do better than easily faked social media posts. And I see no evidence of an apology.
The Russian report suggested that a MIG-29 has the same radar profile as a SU-25, so it's possible the Ukies used their MIG rather than a SU-25.
On the other hand, Russian radar said it was an SU-25, and you would think the Russians would be able to identify a Russian-made plane?
Dan,
". If they had proof that a rebel BUK did the deed, they would have showed us the proof."
Uh, no they wouldnt... rsp
Post a Comment